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1  The Garage / Mopar Tech 'n Tips / Re: Chassis VIN on: July 31, 2016, 03:54:13 PM
These are close-ups of the chassis VIN on the 1969 M300, after the frame has been cleaned and stripped but before being prepped for painting.

Mopar changed the format of their VINs between 1969 and 1970, so this is an example of a pre-1970 VIN.

2  The Garage / Mopar Tech 'n Tips / Chassis VIN on: July 31, 2016, 03:41:02 PM
Knowing the chassis vehicle identification number (VIN) is important to finding the right parts for a motorhome.  (Or other old Mopar vehicles.)

The magenta arrow in the following picture shows where I usually find the chassis VIN.  The chassis in the picture is a 1969 M300.  I have found the chassis VIN in the same place on a 1972 M375  chassis and a 1973 RM350 chassis.

3  The Garage / Mopar Tech 'n Tips / Re: Phosphate & Oil on: March 29, 2012, 09:33:09 PM
The formula:

    3 quarts concentrated phosphoric acid

    9 quarts distilled water

    1/2 cup manganese dioxide

    2 steel wool pads, cleaned and degreased

I used Klean-Strip Phosphoric Prep & Etch.  According to the MSDS, it's 40% phosphoric acid.  Jasco is another brand, although the MSDS says it's made by the same company.  Other sources, which probably list their product as a metal etch or cleaner, will work just as well but I'd read the MSDS to find out the the percentage of acid and to make sure it doesn't include other stuff, such as surfactants or detergents.

Some of the articles I read described using the black stuff inside dry cell batteries (i.e., C- or D-cell batteries) but I prefer a purer compound, without the possibility of other substances.  Chemical supply houses tend to provide forms that are purer than necessary and are usually more (most) expensive.  The best source I found is pottery suppliers because it's also used for coloring pottery glazes.  (I bought two pounds from a local pottery maker.)

Be aware that buying large quantities of manganese dioxide may draw the attention of authorities because it is also used as an oxidizer in fireworks and explosives.  Don't let that hold you back -- the amount you'll need is relatively small unless you're doing P&O on a commercial level.  (Just be aware and prepared to answer questions that may arise.)

The steel wool is available in the paint department of lumber yards, etc.  Finer (00 or 000 grade) is better because you want it to dissolve in the mixture.  (As I understand it, the acid uses the iron in the steel wool instead of stripping what it needs off the part you're treating.)  Do NOT use kitchen pads, such as Brillo, because you'll spend forever cleaning all the soap out of it before you can use it.  We cleaned the pads we used with dish soap and hot water, followed be a good hot rinse, and finished the cleaning with acetone to remove any remaining grease.  (The green cans of brake cleaner are mostly acetone.)
4  The Garage / Mopar Tech 'n Tips / Phosphate & Oil on: March 15, 2012, 04:37:05 PM
I've been studying Phosphate & Oil coatings, sometimes referred to as P&O.  It's a corrosion resistant conversion coating put on new and remanufactured parts, such as brake calipers, bolts, etc.

To organize my research and keep track of what I'm doing and how it's going, I've started this thread ...

Conversion coating is a process of changing (converting) the surface of an item through chemical processes to alter its properties.  The conversion coating is chemically bonded to the item, as opposed to film coatings such as paint.  Phosphate coating is a thin (several microns thick) conversion coating applied to iron and steel to reduce corrosion and improve wear resistance.  For us, there are three important types of phosphate coating:  zinc phosphate, iron phosphate, and manganese phosphate.

Zinc phosphate is a light grey corrosion resistant coating that is typically used on items that will remain bare, without any subsequent coating.  It is similar to galvanizing but is thinner and therefore doesn't change the item's physical dimension as much.

Iron phosphate is something I've already been working with, for several years, using Krud Kutter's Must For Rust and PPG's DX579 and DX520.  The process of etching metal surfaces in preparation for painting usually creates an iron phosphate coating that helps the paint film adhere to the item.

Manganese phosphate is a tougher, more durable conversion coating that is used when wear resistance is an important feature of the desired corrosion resistance.  It has a larger grain structure than either zinc or iron phosphate coatings, resulting in a coarser appearance.  The coarser grain structure is well suited to holding oil or wax compounds, especially those containing corrosion inhibitors.

Another name for the manganese phosphate conversion process is "Parkerizing," which is used on guns and military hardware.  If I understand it correctly, Parkerizing is slightly different than what I'm trying for.
5  The Coffee Shop / The Counter / Anniversary announcement on: February 27, 2012, 06:50:55 PM
Patricia and Michael Griffin quietly celebrated their 35th wedding anniversary on February 26, 2012, at their daughter's home in Two Rivers, Alaska.

Patricia is the daughter of David and Marlene Countryman and the stepdaughter of Hazel Countryman.  She graduated from Monticello High School in Monticello, Iowa, in 1973.

In 1975, Patricia enlisted in the U.S. Air Force and was honorably discharged at the rank of Sergeant upon completing her enlistment in June, 1979.  During her enlistment, she earned the Air Force Commendation Medal and the Air Force Good Conduct Medal.

Following her military service, Patricia returned to school, earning an Associate of Arts in Business Administration and pursuing a bachelor's degree in Business Management while attending Anchorage Community College, University of Alaska - Anchorage, and Southern Illinois University - Edwardsville.

Michael is the son of Dale and Phyllis Griffin and graduated from Bemidji High School in Bemidji, Minnesota, in 1973.  He also attended Bemidji State University prior to enlisting in the U.S. Air Force in late 1975.

On March 1, 1996, Michael retired from the Air Force at the rank of Master Sergeant.  During his military career, Michael earned the Meritorious Service Medal, two Air Force Commendation Medals, a Joint Service Achievement Medal, six Air Force Good Conduct Medals, a National Defense Service Medal, and a Korean Defense Service Medal.

In addition to Bemidji State University, Michael attended a lengthy list of schools during and following his military career, amassing over 180 college credits.

The couple met in 1976 while both were stationed at Scott AFB, Illinois, and were married in Monticello, Iowa, on February 26, 1977.  The couple have two children, Christopher Patrick Griffin, born in June, 1979, and Erin Melinda Russell, born in May, 1981.  They also have four grandchildren, Ravin, Devlin, Vincent, and Kiana.

The couple spend their time pursuing shared interests that include the Internet, reading, automobile and truck restoration, construction, woodworking, boatbuilding, and a variety of languages and cultures.
6  The Parking Lot / Mopar Motorhomes / Re: Griff's Project #1 (aka MLP) on: January 19, 2012, 03:34:55 PM
Found new brake rotors through work and have a pair on non-stocking backorder.

Boss and I went 'round 'n' 'round a couple of months ago trying to find these through CarQuest and every listing was for the R-300 brakes, which have single piston calipers.  He even ordered up one of the rotors so we could compare it to my rotors.  (He didn't believe me when I told him it was the wrong one.)  We finally gave up and decided we'd just go through all the work of reconditioning the rotors I have, which are heavily rusted but still have enough "meat" to be turned.

Then, last Thursday, I was wandering through to see what I could find that I couldn't find through the computers at work.  (I've already proved I can find stuff at home that I can't find on the store computers ... )  I ran across some online catalogs for medium- and heavy-duty trucks that we can't get at through the work computers and, near the end of one of the catalogs was a listing for rotors that showed an interchange for the Kelsey-Hayes part number stamped in my rotors.  The next day, at work, I showed the boss a print-out of the catalog, showed him we couldn't get at the catalog from work, entered the CarQuest part number in the work computers, and put the rotors on order.

The boss's sarcastic response was, "I might as well have you work from home from home," because we've run into this situation before.  He's especially annoyed at the corporate bureaucracy because (1) we've run into this situation before, (2) the company sent one of my coworkers to Anchorage for a week of training in medium- and heavy-duty truck parts, (3) we haven't been allowed to stock medium- and heavy-duty parts we know our customers need regularly, and (4) have been told we can just look up our customers need and order them from the Anchorage warehouse.

BTW - the CarQuest part number is 666-13882.

Meanwhile, I've been researching "phosphate and oil" finishes, sometimes called "P & O" finish.  This is the finish used on many new and remanufactured parts, such as brake calipers.  It's a messy and smelly process but not otherwise difficult, unusually dangerous, or expensive.  Basically, once all the grease, crud, and rust have been removed, you soak the part in mixture of phosphoric acid and manganese dioxide, heated to 195 degrees, rinse the part in clean water, drench it in WD-40, and finish it with an oil containing a rust inhibitor.  (Probably Marvel Mystery Oil.)

Now, I'm just waiting for the weather to warm up enough to do it outside.

As of right now, I have everything lined up to restore the front axle (and other parts) to "new or better condition."
7  The Garage / Mopar Tech 'n Tips / Help!! on: October 12, 2011, 02:38:27 PM
We've got a customer looking for the 4x4 shift boot for a 77 Dodge Warlock Powerwagon.  We're the only people in interior Alaska that has any idea what he's looking for and we can't find it in any of our catalogs.

Any leads you can provide will shorten our (actually, my) search.

8  The Parking Lot / Mopar Motorhomes / Re: Griff's Project #1 (aka MLP) on: September 17, 2011, 11:13:55 PM
Oh, yeah, a couple of other things ...

The front brake pads (finally) came in ... I had to order them twice.  The first time, the Anchorage warehouse actually had zero sets where the computer said they had one set so they cancelled the order.  Then, the computer said the Seattle warehouse had several sets and they apparently had at least one set, because they sent a set up on the barge.

Also, as if I'm not busy enough, it looks like my son-in-law and I may be starting a business.  Tentatively named Riffgan Restorations, we'll be doing powder coating, electrolytic rust removal, and small-to-medium parts restorations.  (Nobody in interior Alaska does powder coating and everyone gets excited when I mention that I do it for myself ... all the automotive painters are urging -- puuushing -- me to do it commercially.) If we do it,  I'll provide the shop, tools, etc. and he'll be primarily running the show.
9  The Parking Lot / Mopar Motorhomes / Re: Griff's Project #1 (aka MLP) on: September 17, 2011, 10:57:55 PM
I would go with separate circuits for oil pressure. The combined units like on my 96 pickup are notorious for being inaccurate as far pressure readings.
For temp. sensor how about the water pump bypass hose. It has flow at all times. Heater hose wouldn't if you had heater temp control off.
I don't know of any one doing that with the water temp. gauge, just an idea that popped into my head,
The oil pressure units are separate circuits.  The switch (on/off) and sensor (variable resistance) are independent, other than being together in a single unit.

Electric gauges are, at best, approximate.  They are actually voltage gauges and the sensors vary the voltage to the gauge by varying the resistance.  Longer/shorter and/or larger/smaller wires can affect the voltage sensed by the gauge by changing the resistance in the circuit.  More importantly, an inadequate ground can throw off the gauge's reading by increasing the resistance on the negative (ground) side of the circuit.  Since most older switches and sensors, and the new oil pressure units, use the engine for a ground, a loose or corroded ground connection for the engine will throw the gauge off.  (That's why you should NOT use thread tape on the sensors ... accept a little leakage or use thread compound sparingly.)

It's easy to check, though.  Run a jumper from the base of the sensor to the battery's negative terminal.  If the gauge reading changes, you know you have an inadequate ground.

It's worth noting the engine's computer only cares whether there is or is not enough oil pressure so the computer uses the switch (on/off) side of the unit.  The sensor (variable resistance) side of the unit is solely for the gauge that gives your typical driver the impression they know what's going on.  If the computer senses inadequate oil pressure, it stores the information as a code and turns on the Check Engine light.  The Check Engine light effectively combines the "big three" idiot lights (oil pressure, engine temperature, and voltage), along with other abnormal conditions, into a single idiot light.  Unfortunately, you need a technician's tools (i.e., a code reader) to actually tell what's happening.

In the case of non-computerized engines, the switch side of the oil pressure unit can be used to provide a warning (buzzer and/or indicator -- idiot -- light) in the event of a catastrophic drop in oil pressure.

Engine temperature sensors are a different case compared to oil pressure sensors.  The computers actually use changes in engine temperature to adjust engine performance so they require the variable resistance.  As far as I can tell, no newer vehicles use engine temperature switches and the switches are actually getting hard to find, even for older vehicles.  A buddy at work, who specializes in Ford engines, and I spent two hours looking for switches for older Fords and Dodges that we knew came with idiot lights.  In every case the company's computer only showed gauge-type sensors.  The application sections in the books did likewise, with neither providing any listing for engine temperature switches.  We had to dig into the section that listed all sensors in part number order before finally finding the applicable switches.  (And, yes, I ordered and received the switch used on early 70's and older Dodge engines.)

Obviously, I haven't been able to find a combined engine temperature switch/sensor unit and am convinced they don't exist.  Because I like the idea of two separate monitor circuits, I'm going with a sensor for the gauge and a separate switch for warning of a catastrophic rise in engine temperature.

BTW - because the computer needs a relatively accurate measure of engine temperature to adjust performance, most newer temperature sensors have gotten away from using the engine for ground and typically have a second terminal for the ground (negative) side of the circuit.  (The Neon sensor a customer was looking for, which kick-started this investigation, has three terminals but I can't find anything that says why there's three or what each one does ... because Neon engines are a wee bit different from LA small blocks, I decide not to pursue that possibility.)

Charlie, the bypass hose is a GREAT suggestion.  Unfortunately, the bypass hose has a 1" inside diameter and Autometer's adapters are sized for 5/8", 3/4", 1-1/4" and 1-1/2" ID hoses.  But, I like your suggestion enough to seriously consider machining a custom adapter for 1" ID hoses.

Finally, I'm also looking at a warning light for low voltage, in addition to a volt meter.  Right now, I'm looking at circuits for LED-type volt meters and simply eliminating all the LEDs except the one that indicates low voltage.
10  The Coffee Shop / Rico's Trivia Game / Re: Trivia #22 on: September 17, 2011, 09:50:32 PM
I was thinking it might be an Imperial from the late 50's or early 60's but haven't had time to go looking for a definite answer.
11  The Garage / Other Stuff / Re: Summer 2011 work on: September 11, 2011, 11:03:23 PM
Between work and the weather, we didn't get as much done as we hoped.  (When I was working, it was nice outside and when I was off, it was raining.)

Got through the 11th course of block, which is the third bond beam and, like last summer, a good place to stop for the winter.  Four more courses to do early next summer and we start the framing.

Did get the entryway part of the basement floor done.

Will try to get some pictures before the snow flies ...

Oh, yeah ... wound up using the drawbar and ball on the trailer hitch to bend the rebar ... worked just about as well and as accurately as anything else we tried.
12  The Parking Lot / Mopar Motorhomes / Re: Griff's Project #1 (aka MLP) on: September 11, 2011, 10:55:56 PM
A question for y'all, but first some updates ...

Eastwood is run by idiots ... as usual, they tried to charge me a premium just because I live in Alaska, even though it costs them exactly the same to the same things to a post office box in Seattle or Los Angeles.

Columbia Coatings has the same thing and is much more reasonable, reliable, and helpful.

Air filter for brake boosters (CarQuest CFI 87720) and new front wheel seals (SLS 3210) came in.  Looked up the driveline carrier bearing assembly (that the local driveline shop said was no longer available) and found we had one on the shelf (BGS HB-88107-A).  (Corporation must have thought there was a demand, because they replaced the one I bought with two in the next restock shipment.)

Brake boosters (51-8055) came on two months early.  We ordered them as non-stock back-order items in an attempt to get them to arrive sometime in October.  CarQuest probably had to go back to the remanufacturer to get them so we thought it'd take a while.  Boss is allowing me to leave them on the shelf until I'm ready to pay for them in October.

Brake calipers (18-4271 and 18-4272, right and left respectively) also came in just as my employee account came on line so I promptly maxed out the account getting them.  (There's a fairly low limit on accounts for part-time employees.)

Front axle, etc. is still laying on the ground.  Need to get them up before the snow covers them and taken apart so I can start reconditioning the components.

Have tracked down the part numbers for shocks, brake flex-lines, master cylinder and other miscellaneous parts but haven't ordered them yet ... no need to stress out the system with too many orders all at once.

Am starting to build a heated 12' x 16' shop so I'll have somewhere besides the snow and cold to work on things ... also need the shop because I'm getting a lot of pressure from local folks to set up a powdercoating business.  (I'll provide the tools, shop, etc. and son-in-law will provide the labor.)

Got washing soda I need to give electrolytic rust removal a try.

Now for the question, but first the background:

A while back, I worked out the details for putting both an oil pressure gauge and an idiot light in using one of the newer sensors that combine the variable resistor and switch in a single unit.  (Leeann's already put it in her motorhome.)  That takes care on one of the three "engine-killers", with the other two being engine temperature and electrical voltage.  Last week, a customer came in looking for a temperature sensor for a Neon, which got me started working on both a gauge and idiot light for engine temperature.

Unlike oil pressure, the computers in newer vehicles actually use the variable output from the engine temperature thermistor to control the engine.  (The computers are only concerned with whether or not there's enough oil pressure so they use the switch part, and the variable resistor part is only there to drive the gauge in the dash that lets the average numskull think they know what's going on.)  In fact, oil pressure switches are becoming rare enough that they're getting hard to find ... it took us a couple of hours of digging through the books to find any listings at all ... in a twenty-year-old catalog the boss kept because he only trusts the computers as far as he can throw them without snagging the cords on the counter.

So, I'm left with with two options:

1.  Tee off off the wire to the gauge with a voltage comparator that triggers an LED and/or buzzer when the sensor resistance reaches a certain point.

--- OR ---

2.  Put in a second sensor (one of the old-style switches) to drive the idiot warning light.

For what it's worth, there's a certain attractiveness in having two separate circuits for monitoring engine temperature.

Autometer makes radiator/heater hose adapters that allow the sensor to be installed in the hoses.  (Picture below.)

What do you think?  If the second option, in the lower radiator hose or the heater hose?

BTW - voltage/alternator/battery idiot light will be easy to do ... just a bit of skull work to modify existing circuit diagrams.
13  The Coffee Shop / Charlie's Comedy Corner / Parts Person's Prayer on: September 11, 2011, 09:57:27 PM
Parts Person's Prayer

Our Father Who Art In Heaven -

Help me find the parts that Satan-spawned computer says we have on the shelf.

14  The Parking Lot / Mopar Motorhomes / Re: Griff's Project #1 (aka MLP) on: August 08, 2011, 10:28:24 AM
Been doing a little here and there on MLP.  Front axle, with springs and sway bar attached, is removed from frame ... it's still laying under the frame but unbolted.

Ordered Arm & Hammer washing soda from Amazon (couldn't find any locally) so I can try electrolytic rust removal.

Got my new pressure tank type sandblaster working ... much more aggressive than my suction blaster.  Need to set up a tarp to catch the sand and recycle it rather than just letting it fall in the dirt on the driveway.  (May buy or build a blast cabinet.)

The reman brake boosters arrived Saturday but I didn't find out until I went to work on Sunday ... that's gonna eat up most of a paycheck, even with my employee discount.  Front wheel seals arrived and are sitting in the box I'm using to collect new parts.

Calipers and brakes booster air filter still in the pipeline, along with miscellaneous other stuff.

Did some powdercoating, as a test, on one of the front axle grease caps.  One coat of zinc-rich primer, two coats of gloss black, and two coats of starlight clear.  Had some contamination issues and the result wasn't quite what I'd hoped for ... the two coats of starlight clear, with the fine metal flakes, lightened the black to a dark gray.  (Trying for a sparkly black, as an accent in the center of the silver wheels.)  Ordered more primer powder, two-stage near-chrome powder, black starlight powder (a translucent black with fine metal flakes), and high-gloss clear powder ... we'll see if Eastwood has decided to be reasonable about their shipping.  (Previously, they've tried to charge me more for shipping simply because I live in Alaska, even though it costs them exactly the same to mail a package to a post office box in Seattle as it does to mail the same package to my post office box in Fairbanks ... I cancelled the order that time because they insisted the extra charge was necessary.)

However, I do like the "starlight" effect ... metal flakes too fine to notice until light hits them.

And, finally, the CarQuest store where I work has the center driveline bearing support assembly in stock.
15  The Parking Lot / Mopar Motorhomes / Re: Griff's Project #1 (aka MLP) on: July 16, 2011, 02:14:05 PM
Some of you may remember, a couple of years ago, I went through a lot of research trying to find calipers for the RM350 chassis.  All the catalogs showed single piston calipers and this chassis had dual piston calipers.

Using the casting number off the calipers (KH91133), I found a match at NAPA and they actually had a set on the shelf.  My buddy at NAPA checked and said they were a regularly stocked item so I didn't buy them right then ...

A couple of months ago, that NAPA store caught fire and burned up.  Everything inside was declared contaminated and hauled off the the hazmat depot ... including my &^%$#@& calipers.

So, I started digging through the CarQuest catalogs and found a listing that actually specified "w/ Kelsey Hayes dual piston calipers."  Double-checked the cross reference to verify and checked to see if there were any in the system ... six of each (right and left) in Portland, so I ordered a set.  (I want them in my grubby mitts this time.)

CarQuest p/n is 18-4271 (right) and 18-4272 (left).

Brake pads are in Anchorage ... p/n RMD87 ... and regularly stocked so I haven't ordered them yet.  Waiting until fall, when I'm through buying building materials and can start spending (more) of my paychecks on MLP.

Next, I went looking for the brake boosters.  (They're 38 years old so I figured I'd go ahead and replace them rather than waiting for one or both of them to fail.)  Found an old CarQuest booster catalog (the same one I used to get the p/n for Leeann's booster) with a listing that kinda, sorta seem right.  Cross referenced the tag number on the existing boosters to verify ... p/n 51-8055 and the checked the system for availability and price.  List price is somewhere between $400 and $500, jobber price is $277, and employee price is $177.  (Yes, that's one of the main reasons I took this job.)  However, none in the system so they have to be ordered direct from the rebuilder.  (I think it's Precision Rebuilders.)  The system also specifies UPS Ground shipping, which probably means around $200 each to Alaska and they'd probably be damaged, if they arrive at all.  (UPS has damaged 40% of the packaging and lost significant parts of 20% of the shipments sent to me via UPS "service".)

Talked to the boss about my UPS shipping issues and also told him I wouldn't be able to pay for them until October, so he ordered them as a non-stock, back-ordered item through normal CarQuest channels, versus special order "get-'em-here-quick" channels.

Also looked for, and found, listings for the check valves ... CarQuest is really proud of them so I'm gonna find out/figure out how to test the ones I have before ordering one.  (No, they're NOT gold-plated, contrary to what the price seemed to indicate.)

Next, we started trying to find rotors ... which is when the real fun started.  All the catalogs claimed p/n 5318 but the online picture didn't look right.  Boss kept insisting they had to be the right ones and I kept telling him I'd been around the search flagpole many times, without success.  (I even tried to bet him they weren't right ... smart man, because making bets is another source of income for me ... because I don't gamble.)  So, he ordered one from Anchorage and I pulled the right hub and rotor off the chassis.

The 5318 rotor arrived and he could see the difference from 20 feet away.  (The 5318 rotor has a high "hat" and the rotor off the chassis barely has any "hat" at all.)  He then spent most of an afternoon wading through catalogs and the online system, calling anyone and everyone who might know something, and pounding the hell out of the Internet trying to find a replacement set.  The best he could do is find one (expensive) set in the Internet and no way to order then them through CarQuest.  (I found three more, less expensive, sources on the 'net that evening so now he believes me when I say, "If it exists on the 'net. I can find it.")

Having given up trying to find a set, the boss took a close look at the rotors I had.  They've go lots of rust pitting but it looks like they've never been turned so he decided we can salvage and restore them.  I'm gonna sandblast the rust off them and we'll shave the rust pits off the rim.  Everyone at work is recommending 500 degree caliper paint but I'm not too sure.  I'm leaning towards a black oxide coating or some kind of durable plating.  After they're restored (as much as we can), we'll turn 'em and they should be good to go.

BTW - I actually found four sources on the 'net, besides the one the boss found.  However, when I entered the number one of the sources claimed fit a RM350 chassis, the CarQuest system cross-referenced it back to the same &%$#&@ 5318 part number. lists a pair for $325 and their specifications match the rotors I have.  Alretta says they can provide the right rotors (and mention the wide variation used on old Dodge motorhome chassis) but I'd have to call them.  The third source seems right but doesn't have enough info online for me to be sure.  (So, if we can't salvage the rotors I have, I can get replacements.)

When I pulled the hub and rotor, the first thing I noticed was whoever put it together definitely believed in bearing grease ... there was at least a half tube inside the hub.  The grease on the bearings was gray (not black) and there was a big glob between the bearings that was oxidized but effectively unused.  The bearings look new, other than a bit of tarnish where they slide onto the spindles.

The seal doesn't have a number on it so I called a buddy at work (can't have him getting bored on a rainy Saturday morning) and he cross-referenced the number from my OEM catalog and ordered a pair from Anchorage.

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